From: Joe Baptista <baptista(_at_)publicroot(_dot_)org>
Subject: Re: Unicode.org Software Internationalisation Standards
&Specification
To: linuxalinux(_at_)yahoo(_dot_)co(_dot_)uk
Cc: ietf(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org, john-ietf(_at_)jck(_dot_)com
Date: Sunday, 2 November, 2008, 2:08 PM
This all smells bad.
regards
joe baptista
On Sun, Nov 2, 2008 at 8:48 AM, linuxa linux
<linuxalinux(_at_)yahoo(_dot_)co(_dot_)uk>wrote:
Doug, Thanks for your response that shows your
knowledge and expertise
about internet / computer things, common sense,
organisational topics and
also the replacing k/K to unicode 0915 glyph shape
issue.
"........You might as well send your message to
your MP or to the Queen,
for all the good it will do to send it to IETF."
Airing the issue to the internet / computer community.
"I don't speak for their mailing-list
administrator........."
The Unicode.org website home page copy that I quoted
is not factual.
"Accusing an organization of process failure and
insensitivity and
stubbornness is not usually a productive way to get
them to come around to
your point of view."
The Unicode.org website page copy that I quoted is not
factual.
"You have stipulated that this
constitutes........"
The Unicode.org website page copy that I quoted is not
factual. There
should be some limitations. They don't have a
demo that proves the first
quote and the Unicode.org is not a framework.
".......You are accusing Unicode of things it is
not responsible for. This
is like blaming the weatherman when it rains."
The Unicode.org website page copy that I quoted is not
factual. There
should be some limitations. They should clarify what
they are not
responsible for. Their home page copy that I quoted
is a trap for
Unicode.org and readers.
"You are trying to change the basic form of a
letter that has existed in
the Latin alphabet for over two thousand years, on the
basis of an
association between the K glyph and the intersection
of three rivers,
derived loosely from a secondary Krishna text.
["that the letter K
represents suicide and needs to be changed"] You
are trying to change the
basic form of a letter recognized by billions of
people, and one of your
first moves is to approach an international
standards-making organization,
which does NOT standardize the Latin alphabet itself
and is NOT in the
business of deciding what letters are supposed to look
like, and accuse them
of improper conduct because they do not immediately
modify their charts and
develop new fonts based on your views, which so far I
have only heard from
ONE person. To say you are outside the mainstream
would be a serious
understatement."
The latin / roman k/K letter needs to be replaced to
another shape for
reasons you know. You have to understand that issue
is beyond
organisational management because it is related to
human life. Approaching
Unicode.org and IETF.org was essential because they
claim to have various
controls over internet / computer transmitted
language. Some helpful
interim things should be put in place, leadership and
management is much
needed. Unicode.org website home page communicates
the wrong impression and
they should correct that.
"Style of what?....Content of what? The standard
is described in
excruciating detail at
http://www.unicode.org/versions/Unicode5.1.0/......Unicode
doesn't tell people how to design user interfaces. That
is
completely up to application developers, as it should
be.....See
http://www.unicode.org/consortium/join.html
.....Unicode doesn't tell
people how to build applications, whether open-source
or proprietary. Do
you feel it should?"
Thus Unicode.org has not any framework. Certain
programmers thus become
baffled. The Unicode.org home page copy that I quoted
is not factual.
There should be some limitations.
"It does not say that it will take you by the
hand and show you how to
program, configure, or use a computer in any
language."
Unicode.org are unjustly saying things on the website
home page copy that I
quoted, they are not communicating there what they are
not responsible for.
They are leaving this to other imaginations and
trapping themselves and
others.
"Unicode makes it possible to put tens of
thousands of different characters
on a .....a plain-text document"
I refer to .txt files, are you also suggesting that
you can put save a .txt
file on the computer that has unicode 0915 glyph
shape?
"What sort of "framework" are you
looking for to accomplish your goals? Be
specific, please, for once."
I was being specific that there is not any framework
about Style, Content,
User Interface, Membership and Extensions, these
generic areas that can help
Software Internationalisation otherwise certain
programmers would not get
baffled for example at particular opensource code
applications when they are
asked to remove all k/K letters and replace them with
unicode 0915 glyph
shape. There should be some catch-all process /
principle at header and
footer of a code for example BBCode / HTML has this
and this principle
perhaps should be considered to ease the burden. I am
not a coder /
programmer thus I am not sure whether this way is
possible.
"......It can *only* mean granting of favors,
such as employment or
political status, to personal relatives regardless of
their qualifications.
You can say "corporate nepotism" if you
like and English speakers will
automatically interpret this as "someone in a
corporation was made
vice-president because he was someone else's
brother, not because he
deserved it." Nobody will interpret this as
"collusion between
corporations" or "unfair bias." You
need to pick another word that really
means what you want it to mean. Nobody can stop you
from misusing this word
if you insist, but they are within their rights to
laugh and ignore you."
I saw the Wikipedia "nepotism" meaning and
it includes "friends" not only
"relatives." Thus "nepotism" is a
problem at organisational and corporate
networks. This includes Unicode.org and IETF.org.
Leadership and
management are required to prevent this.
"When the day comes when you convince a
SIGNIFICANT number of Latin-script
users, worldwide, that the letter K represents suicide
and needs to be
changed, THEN it is time to approach the standards
organizations
*respectfully* and ask them to make changes that
reflect a change that a
SIGNIFICANT number of people have already adopted. It
needs to be something
people see in newspapers and on street signs and on
television. Until then,
this effort will not be seen constructively."
I repeat.....The latin / roman k/K letter needs to be
replaced to another
shape for reasons you know. You have to understand
that issue is beyond
organisational management because it is related to
human life. Approaching
Unicode.org and IETF.org was essential because they
claim to have various
controls over internet / computer transmitted
language. Some helpful
interim things should be put in place, leadership and
management is much
needed. Unicode.org website home page communicates
the wrong impression and
they should correct that.
John, Thanks for your response.
Unicode.org don't want to listen anymore when it
relates to their website
home page because they blocked my message to the
mailing list that was
critical about this. Unicode.org should say
categorically they are not
responsible for framework. However they are
communicating the wrong
impression to the internet / computer community.
Regards
Meeku
http://twitter.com/nepotism
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Joe Baptista
www.publicroot.org
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