In message
<71C4C55F198BD211B24F0000F842F15807ED9CD9(_at_)reoexc6(_dot_)reo(_dot_)cpqcorp(_dot_)net>,
"Parkinson, Jonathan" typed:
In the UK we have the same type of problem, this time from my Favorite
Company MI5.
I agree.
i also think that there are important lessons for lawmakers in other countries,
so it is a suitable subject for IETF discussion.
'The UK is leading the world when it comes to high-tech spying on its
citizens'
Please see
http://news6.thdo.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sci/tech/newsid_762000/762514.stm=
yes, this is something that the UK should be ashamed of - there is
very good documentary evidence that the government is ignoring
technical advice on the costs ot the ISP community in terms of
implementing this they wayu that the UK law was designed, or the risks
to citizens, and the loss of revenue when content and application
providers move their business to palecs which implement less stupid,
expensive and ineffective ways to intercept criminal or terrorist
communication - the home offices response to criticism was a
masterpiece of political rubbish, and included specific items which
were lies. examples include assertions about what other coutnries
were doing in terms of techniocal implementations of both intercept,
and who gets charged for the implementation cost.
Lets face it, internet service providers will be forced to install =
black
boxes in their=20
data centres that connect directly to an MI5 monitoring centre in =
London.
Now that would=20
be nice to hack into. =20
when it happens, it will be a good day for demoracy.
one trick to do is to put a bunch of fake data on the net whch causes them
to either act on it, or have to randiomize whether they act or not
(see cryptonomicon) so that real miscreants wont be able to tell they
are listening (fairly standard stuff in fact) - turns out that there
are several ways to put in place random traffic generators (which even
more interestingly can also be part of billing systems) that run
counter-intuitive, but make it very hard to do RIP but do allow one to
retain privacy.....
More to the point, Who is going to fund this? 'thinking' Oh yes thats =
why
Petrol in the=20
UK has now passed the =A31.03 per litre barrier.
'http://www.rip-off.co.uk/fuel.htm'=20
:-)
right - but in that case, we can take public transport or buy a bike -
in the case of ecommerce, it can go elsewhere and the UK loses.
note that a lot of the GRID users are talking about striping data over
multiple paths (yes, and at 1.2Gbps per path) so the data copy costs
of intercept are more than double the data transfer - in fact they
would be just with normal dynamic routing
the reason the UK bill is confused is that it was written by
telephants - people who probably lost their jobs as the tradditonal
phone business goes marginal and now advise shady organisations such
as gchq - these folks understand that the Exchange in the PSTN is the
natuaral point for billing and is therefore also quite a reasnable
palce to do intercept
what they dont get is that there is no natural point to do this in a
packet net, least of all a datagram, end to end network, except at the
end points.....
what annoys me is that the UK government has persistnytly caimed that
ALL opponents of the bill oppose intercept, when in fact almost all
the ones I've spoken to object to a STUPID pointless waste of money,
not to intercept at feasiable (E.g. end systems - such as email
servers, web, web cachce/proxy, napster server etc) points....
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Crowcroft
[mailto:J(_dot_)Crowcroft(_at_)cs(_dot_)ucl(_dot_)ac(_dot_)uk]
Sent: Friday, July 14, 2000 12:03 PM
To: Anthony Atkielski
Cc: ietf
Subject: Re: Email Privacy eating software
In message <01dc01bfed78$0e7a55a0$0a00000a(_at_)contactdish>, Anthony =
Atkielski
type
d:
I don't understand why the FBI feels that it needs to have a =
top-secret
black box attached to the ISP's network. Why not just have the ISP
provide
a copy of all e-mail to or from the specified mailbox?
wiretap is a weapon in the FBI's armoury
in the US, YOU have the right to bear arms
You should demand the constitutional right to wiretap the FBI and CIA =
and so
on right now.
that will fix things.
j.
cheers
jon