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RE: Last Call: 'Guidance for AAA Key management' to BCP (draft-housley-aaa-key-mgmt)

2006-11-10 11:58:17
Thanks Bernard,

Comments inline.  

-----Original Message-----
From: Bernard Aboba [mailto:aboba(_at_)internaut(_dot_)com] 
Sent: Wednesday, November 08, 2006 2:00 PM
To: ietf(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org
Cc: Joseph Salowey (jsalowey)
Subject: Re: Last Call: 'Guidance for AAA Key management' to 
BCP (draft-housley-aaa-key-mgmt)

I believe that the document will have implications for the 
RADIUS protocol.  For example, during the RADEXT WG meeting 
at IETF 67, we discussed the need for crypto-agility in 
RADIUS, and the current lack of ability to negotiate 
cryptographic algorithms.  This is why Crypto-agility was 
added as a RADEXT WG work item. 

Since Diameter already supports cryptographic algorithm 
negotiation, I do not believe that crypto-agility is an issue there. 

My reading of the document is that it does not impose any 
security requirements on EAP methods beyond those described 
in RFC 4017 and RFC 3748.  At least that is what is being 
assumed in the EAP Key Management Framework document, which 
cites RFC 4017 and RFC 3748 as meeting the requirements. 


[Joe] I think it would be helpful to include an appendix on how existing
commonly deployed mechanisms compare against these requirements.  What
do you think?

I think that the term 'AAA key management' applies to 
situations which involve use of AAA for derivation or 
transport of keying material.  In the case of EAP, that would 
include EAP methods, AAA protocols as well as the SAP.  

1. I do think that SAP designers are an audience, 
particularly since that work often occurs outside of IETF. 

2. The AAA protocol does play a role in freshness, because it 
can support replay protection, preventing the same key 
transport message from being replayed, thereby introducing 
stale keys.  

3.  I think that "authentication of all parties" is distinct 
from context binding, although it is certainly a 
pre-requisite for it.  Without defining the parties to the 
key management exchange and authenticating them, it is not 
possible to protect against key usage outside of the 
authorized scope. 

[Joe] I don't think this is always the case.  Authenticating identity is
different that authorizing scope.  They may depend upon one another, but
do not necessarily have to. 

4. Agree that integrity should also be called out. 

5. There are vulnerabilities associated with the 802.11i key 
naming scheme.  For example, I believe that PSK cracking 
tools have been built that perform offline dictionary attacks 
on the 802.11i key names.  
EAP methods satisfying RFC 4017 criteria are not vulnerable, 
but I do think it illustrates the potential dangers.  The 
problem is fixed in 802.11r. 

[Joe] OK, how does .11r solve the problem?

6. I believe this section applies to binding within all 
phases, including AAA, EAP and SAP.  Generally AAA integrity 
protection mechanisms should satisfy the binding requirements 
(or at least that is what is assumed in the EAP Key 
Management Framework document).  For EAP, the requirements 
are met by RFC 4017 requirements (including Channel Binding 
support).  So in practice the issue has mostly arisen within 
SAP designs, some of which have not properly handled key 
scoping and binding.  For example, within IEEE 802.11i, the 
authenticator is not identified, only the port/BSSID so that 
the peer cannot properly determine the authenticator key 
scope.  This is also fixed in 802.11r. 

[Joe] OK, I need to look at .11r.  

7.  I think some clarification may be needed here.  As stated 
in the EAP Key Management Framework document, the 
authenticator and AAA client are always co-located (though 
these entities may both be distributed as in some CAPWAP 
architectures). 

[Joe] OK, this needs clarification. This section also mentions the
keying draft without referencing it. 

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Hi Russ and Bernard,

I'm not really clear on the purpose of the document.  What 
does it apply to?  Does it require changes to existing AAA 
protocols? Does it add new requirements to EAP methods that 
are not in RFC3748? It would probably be good to reference 
3748 when it applies to a requirement in this document (such 
as replay protection, strong fresh session keys, etc.).

What does AAA key management protocol refer to?  Is it the 
combination of EAP, AAA and Security Association Protocol?  

A few comments on this document

1. Section 3 states "This section provides guidance to AAA 
protocol designers and EAP method designers."

This should include designers of "security association 
protocols" as well since many of the requirements apply to them.

2. Strong fresh session keys

In this section it is not clear what the subject session keys 
are.  It is not clear to me what role the AAA protocol plays 
in "ensure that the keying material supplied as an input to 
session key derivation is fresh"


Also wouldn't key caching be relevant on the EAP server 
rather than the "AAA server"?

3.  Authenticate all parties

What is the AAA key management protocol?  It seems that some 
of this section is about validating keys are used within they 
correct context and not necessarily authentication.  Maybe 
part of this section should belong with the context binding section. 

4. Keying material confidentiality

It seems that a system should also preserve key material 
integrity (perhaps this is assumed in confidentiality). 

5. Unique Key Names

This section states "the key name MUST NOT be based on the 
keying material itself." 802.11i uses this technique; are 
there vulnerabilities associated with this?  

6. Bind key to its context

In this section it is not clear what the "protocol" is or how 
the binding would occur.  What is meant by "The manner in 
which the keying material is expected to be used." 
 
7. Security considerations

The first paragraph is difficult to understand.  It seems to 
be stating that the authenticator can be separated from a AAA 
client as long as the context of the request is communicated 
correctly between parties. Is this it? 


Joe


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