I agree with Simon that the IETF's disclosure page could use some work,
it seems rather confusing and it is not consistently filled out.
Comments inline below:
If your interpretation were correct, then we would have to
say that Certicom is not claiming IPR on _any_ IETF
document---draft or RFC---since none are listed in Section V.
But I think that is obviously incorrect---I think you have
misinterpreted what should be in which section.
[Joe] Are we both looking at https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/1154/? In
section V I see several documents listed:
"RFC 3278, RFC 4109, RFC 4492, RFC 4753, RFC 4754, RFC 4869, RFC 5008,
RFC 5289, draft-rescorla-tls-suiteb-12, draft-green-secsh-ecc-07,
draft-igoe-secsh-suiteb-00, draft-ietf-smime-3278bis-07,
draft-ietf-smime-sha2-11"
Section titles and descriptions:
Section IV. IETF Document or Other Contribution to Which
this IPR Disclosure Relates:
Section V. Disclosure of Patent Information (i.e., patents
or patent applications required to be disclosed by Section 6
of RFC 3979)
Section IV lists the drafts and RFCs. Section V lists the patents.
One would not expect to find a draft or RFC listed in Section
V, nor a patent listed in Section IV.
Extractor and other documents are listed in section IV.
[Joe] Section V also has a sub-section C, which allows you to specify
what parts of IETF documents are covered by the patent information
disclosed in section V. This section lists several documents which is a
subset of what is mentioned in section IV. This seems straight forward
to me.
Joe
--Dean
On Wed, 22 Jul 2009, Joseph Salowey (jsalowey) wrote:
While I see that draft-ietf-tls-extractor is listed in section IV of
#1154 IPR disclosure as related material, I see that it is
explicitly
not listed in section V part C which lists what is specifically
covered by the disclosure. I don't think Certicom is
claiming IPR on
draft-ietf-tls-extractor because it is not among the list
of documents
in section V.
Joe
-----Original Message-----
From: ietf-bounces(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org
[mailto:ietf-bounces(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org] On Behalf
Of Simon Josefsson
Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2009 12:32 PM
To: ietf(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org; tls(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org
Subject: Re: Last Call: draft-ietf-tls-extractor (Keying Material
Exportersfor Transport Layer Security (TLS)) to Proposed Standard
With the caveat that I have recently returned from vacation, and
consequently may have missed some clarifications or paged out some
context:
If the #1154 IPR disclosure is the final word from
Certicom on this
document, I don't support advancing this document on the
standards
track. My concern remains that Certicom claims they have
IPR that
covers the document -- that is what the
#1154 disclosure says (section IV). The additional information
provided in the PDF is not helping: it grants a license for use
together with ECC. It doesn't say anything about the use without
ECC.
The way I see it, TLS implementers and the broader
Internet does not
gain something significant by having this document
published. Other
IETF documents can use the TLS PRF to derive keying material. On
the contrary, it seems both TLS implementers and the broader
Internet community would be hurt by publishing the document since
having patent threats looming over widely used techniques has
stability and interoperability impacts.
I recall that Certicom was positive about clarifying their
intentions so maybe we can continue that discussion and get
something more useful than the recent disclosure.
Speaking as TLS implementer of the document and document
[1] author
that reference this document, /Simon
[1]
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-josefsson-krb5starttls-bootstrap-02
The IESG <iesg-secretary(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org> writes:
The IESG has received a request from the Transport
Layer Security
WG
(tls) to consider the following document:
- 'Keying Material Exporters for Transport Layer
Security (TLS) '
<draft-ietf-tls-extractor-06.txt> as a Proposed Standard
The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks,
and solicits
final comments on this action. Please send substantive
comments
to the ietf(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org mailing lists by 2009-08-10.
Exceptionally, comments
may be sent to iesg(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org instead. In either case, please
retain the beginning of the Subject line to allow
automated sorting.
The file can be obtained via
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-tls-extractor-06.tx
t
IESG discussion can be tracked via
https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/pidtracker.cgi?command=view_id&d
Ta
g=16821&rfc_flag=0
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