FYI there is a form of discovery for OAuth defined in
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mills-kitten-sasl-oauth-02 which uses LINK
headers.
________________________________
From: Eran Hammer-Lahav <eran(_at_)hueniverse(_dot_)com>
To: Hannes Tschofenig <hannes(_dot_)tschofenig(_at_)gmx(_dot_)net>; Mark
Nottingham <mnot(_at_)mnot(_dot_)net>
Cc: "ietf(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org IETF" <ietf(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org>; oauth WG
<oauth(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org>
Sent: Sunday, July 3, 2011 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: [OAUTH-WG] Second Last Call: <draft-hammer-hostmeta-16.txt> (Web
Host Metadata) to Proposed Standard -- feedback
Hannes,
None of the current OAuth WG document address discovery in any way, so clearly
there will be no use of XRD. But the OAuth community predating the IETF had
multiple proposals for it. In addition, multiple times on the IETF OAuth WG
list, people have suggested using host-meta and XRD for discovery purposes.
The idea that XRD was reused without merit is both misleading and
mean-spirited. Personally, I'm sick of it, especially coming from standards
professionals.
XRD was largely developed by the same people who worked on host-meta. XRD
predated host-meta and was designed to cover the wider use case. Host-meta was
an important use case when developing XRD in its final few months. It was done
in OASIS out of respect to proper standards process in which the body that
originated a work (XRDS) gets to keep it.
I challenge anyone to find any faults with the IPR policy or process used to
develop host-meta in OASIS.
XRD is one of the simplest XML formats I have seen. I bet most of the people
bashing it now have never bothered to read it. At least some of these people
have been personally invited by me to comment on XRD while it was still in
development and chose to dismiss it.
XRD was designed in a very open process with plenty of community feedback and
it was significantly simplified based on that feedback. In addition, host-meta
further simplifies it by profiling it down, removing some of the more complex
elements like Subject and Alias (which are very useful in other contexts). XRD
is nothing more than a cleaner version of HTML <LINK> elements with literally a
handful of new elements based on well defined and widely supported
requirements. It's entire semantic meaning is based on the IETF Link relation
registry RFC.
There is something very disturbing going on these days in how people treat
XML-based formats, especially form OASIS.
When host-meta's predecessor - side–meta – was originally proposed a few years
ago, Mark Nottingham proposed an XML format not that different from XRD. There
is nothing wrong with JSON taking over as a simpler alternative. I personally
prefer JSON much better. But it would be reckless and counter productive to
ignore a decade of work on XML formats just because it is no longer cool. Feels
like we back in high school.
If you have technical arguments against host-meta, please share. But if your
objections are based on changing trends, dislike of XML or anything OASIS, grow
up.
EHL
From: Hannes Tschofenig <hannes(_dot_)tschofenig(_at_)gmx(_dot_)net>
Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2011 00:36:29 -0700
To: Mark Nottingham <mnot(_at_)mnot(_dot_)net>
Cc: Hannes Tschofenig <hannes(_dot_)tschofenig(_at_)gmx(_dot_)net>,
"ietf(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org IETF" <ietf(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org>, Eran Hammer-lahav
<eran(_at_)hueniverse(_dot_)com>, oauth WG <oauth(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org>
Subject: Re: Second Last Call: <draft-hammer-hostmeta-16.txt> (Web Host
Metadata) to Proposed Standard -- feedback
I also never really understood why XRD was re-used.
Btw, XRD is not used by any of the current OAuth WG documents, see
http://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/oauth/
On Jun 22, 2011, at 8:08 AM, Mark Nottingham wrote:
* XRD -- XRD is an OASIS spec that's used by OpenID and OAuth. Maybe I'm just
scarred by WS-*, but it seems very over-engineered for what it does. I
understand that the communities had reasons for using it to leverage an
existing user base for their specific user cases, but I don't see any reason
to generalise such a beast into a generic mechanism.
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