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Re: [spfbis] Last Call: <draft-ietf-spfbis-4408bis-19.txt> (Sender Policy Framework (SPF) for Authorizing Use of Domains in Email, Version 1) to Proposed Standard

2013-08-22 09:40:20

On Aug 22, 2013, at 4:36 AM, Jelte Jansen 
<jelte(_dot_)jansen(_at_)sidn(_dot_)nl> wrote:

On 08/21/2013 08:44 PM, Olafur Gudmundsson wrote:

Most of the recent arguments against SPF type have come down to the 
following (as far as I can tell): 
     a) I can not add SPF RRtype  via my provisioning system into my DNS 
servers
     b) My firewall doesl not let SPF Records through 
     c) My DNS library does not return SPF records through or does not 
understand it, thus the application can not receive it.
     d) Looking up SPF is a waste of time as they do not get through, thus 
we only look up TXT

So what I have taken from this is that the DNS infrastructure is agnostic to 
RRtype=99 but the 
edges have problems. 
As to the arguments 7 years is not long enough to reach conclusion and force 
the changes through the
infrastructure and to the edges. The "need" for SPF has been blunted by the 
"DUAL SPF/TXT" strategy and 
thus we are basically in the place where the path of lowest-resistence has 
taken us. 

What I want the IESG to add a note to the document is that says something 
like the following: 
"The retirement of SPF from specification is not to be taken that new 
RRtypes can not be used by applications, 
the retirement is consequence of the dual "quick-deploy" strategy. The IETF 
will continue to advocate application 
specific RRtypes applications/firewalls/libraries SHOULD support that 
approach."


So what makes you think the above 4 points will not be a problem for the
next protocol that comes along and needs (apex) RR data? And the one
after that?


There are two reasons, mail is a legacy application with lots of old cruft 
around it. 
New protocols on the other hand can start with clean slate, and the use of the 
protocol is
optional unlike email. 
With a new protocol you can tell someone "you can not use Vendor X as it does 
not support Y" 
and they will put up a system that works, for email there is installed base and 
enterprise policies to use
Vendor X then SPF RR can not be used. 


While I appreciate the argument 'this works now, and it is used'
(running code, and all that), I am very worried that we'll end up with
what is essentially a free-form blob containing data for several
protocols at the zone apexes instead of a structured DNS.

So if this approach is taken, I suggest the wording be much stronger, in
the hope this chicken/egg problem (with 5 levels of eggs. or chickens)
will be somewhat mitigated at some point. Preferably with some
higher-level strategy to support that goal.

Jelte


I agree 

        Olafur


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