RE: Complaining about ADs to Nomcom (Re: Voting (again))

Spencer, 

You hit an important issue. Having a small group of people
choose who they want feedback from (granted everyone else is welcome 
to send feedback without knowing the options for ADs) is not 
a recipe for a successful process. I haven't yet seen a good reason
for not publicising the names of people nominated for an AD position.
Until this is done, we can't claim an open process for AD selection.

Why have a "selected" group of people knowing all the information necessary
to choose an AD? And on what basis are these people selected? I know
people that are not chairing any WGs that were asked for input by the nomcom
while others weren't. 

I can see pros and cons in publicising the list of nominees, but in 
the absence of a clear advantage I choose openness, because eventually, an
open process should be self-correcting. I can't say the same about the 
current process.

Hesham


> Spencer Dawkins wrote:
>
> > Just to agree with JohnL,
> >
> > > NOMCOM has been good about soliciting feedback, but I still think 
> > > that we miss out on useful feedback because IETF members cannot 
> > > reliably say who is a candidate and who is not.  Some 
> candidates have 
> > > sent around BCC: mails, from time-to-time, saying that they are a 
> > > candidate & would appreciate folks to send comments to 
> NOMCOM. This 
> > > doesn't seem like a good way for getting information 'public.'
> >
> > I've served as a WG chair, and as a member of the General Area 
> > Directorate, so I'm one of the people that NOMCOM was 
> actively seeking 
> > input from ("this is a list of the people who have been 
> nominated for 
> > X Area Director, plus a couple of ringers, please tell us what you 
> > think we should know that would help us make a better decision").
> >
> > My point is that I *have* seen a complete list of nominations, 
> > including a couple of ringers, for specific AD positions, 
> and I *have* 
> > seen a complete list of nominations for IAB positions.
> >
> > This is not a bad thing (the AD positions were in areas I 
> was working 
> > closely with). The less-than-desirable part is that my input on 
> > unannounced candidates was based on more information about who was 
> > being considered than was generally available. I could say "that 
> > person would be the greatest disaster for the IETF since ...", and 
> > people who disagreed with my input don't even know the 
> person is being 
> > considered ... unless they also got the same list, or unless that 
> > specific person happened to ask others to provide NOMCOM input.
> >
> > Hardly seems fair, does it?
> >
> > For the last two years, I've met with the NOMCOM 
> representatives and 
> > gone through the list of every IAB/IESG member that's up 
> for renewal, 
> > so it's not like people don't TRY to provide good input 
> (positive and 
> > negative). But it's difficult to provide input on unannounced 
> > candidates, unless they "out" themselves.
> >
> > Are we supposed to send a list of notorious Internet 
> kooks, just in 
> > case one of them has been nominated for something?
> >
> > > In the absence of facts, there are lots of rumors about whether a 
> > > specific IESG / IAB member is stepping down or not; reasons why; 
> > > etc.  This doesn't seem to be an optimal process, IMO.
> >
> > I've also had conversations with ADs who decided to step 
> down, then 
> > decided not to, then decided to step down (lather, rinse, repeat). 
> > Private sampling doesn't seem to provide reliable 
> information, even 
> > when the sampling is direct-to-the-intermittent-candidate.
> >
> > ... and, to go a tiny bit closer toward the edge ... 
> saying that we 
> > believe someone can serve successfully as an AD for two years (and 
> > hopefully for four, since it takes a year to come up to 
> speed, we are 
> > told), but is too sensitive to be nominated publically for the 
> > position, seems silly. If someone cares what people think 
> that much, 
> > how can the same person serve with integrity after being selected?
> >
> > Spencer
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf
>
>
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