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Re: avoiding pitfalls in v4/v6 NAT (was Re: About IETF communication skills)

2008-08-03 16:07:35
Noel Chiappa wrote:
    > From: Keith Moore <moore(_at_)network-heretics(_dot_)com>

    > You don't need to add it to all (or most) IPv6 implementations.

More hair-splitting...

It's not hair-splitting if it significantly reduces the barrier to adoption.

    > The goal ... is not to magically make all boxes and apps suddenly be
    > able to communicate with both IPv4-only and IPv6-only hosts as if there
> were no difference between the two.
So you're willing to live with the converse of that? I.e. a situation where
communication between the two groups is spotty and unpredictable?

I'm willing to live with a world where a v6-only app that needs to communicate with a v4 peer, or a v4-only app that needs to communicate with a v6 peer, has a well-defined way of doing so - even though it might require extra effort (in the form of extra API calls and/or binding to a library that does them implicitly) and infrastructure (in the form of a willing v4-v6 NAT). (Particularly if this extra effort doesn't burden communication between v6-only peers.)

    > Enterprise network management will continue to evolve and they'll see
> the benefits of using v6.
A familiar prediction...

Again, it's a big topic. I don't want to gloss over the problems - they're considerable. But neither do I assume that enterprise network operators in general are not capable of leveraging advantages of IPv6.

    >> Either this functionality is added to .. IPv6 .., or the IPv6/v4
    >> NAT boxes .. will display the same crippling problems as v4/v4 NAT...

    > No, because (a) you're not trying to impose this on all hosts or apps,
    > ... and (c) you engineer these boxes from day one in such a way as to
    > avoid the crippling problems we've experience in v4 NAT.

I see no refutation of my basic observation, here.

I see no support for your assertion that this needs to be a core part of IPv6.

Keith
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