ietf-asrg
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Re: [Asrg] Update to DS Protocol draft

2003-03-23 01:09:10
Some notes on your proposal:

I. ASRG can not send documents protocols to IETF for "protocols", they 
can only be or something that may become "informational" RFC
(Note: this is major difference between IRTF and IETF as was explained to me)
So your draft would have to go as individual submission especially since 
asrg is not yet at the point of submitting any kind of documents.

II. What you're proposing is just like SRV RMX record. But srv records are 
more advanced. Your point that DNS does not support it yet is not 
appropriate - you expect sites to update software to support DS draft but 
not update their dns software... I means if domain has to put this record 
in, it might as well update dns software, not that complex and if somebody 
is going to use the records, they'd have to update mail software, so I do 
not see problem updating dns software. But really this is not a main issue 
with the proposal...

III. As I already mentioned multiple times before this is typical 
"RMX/Mail-From" style proposal which has the following problems:
 1.You only authenticate MAIL FROM header but if "From:" is forged, that 
   is what user will see on their MUA, not MAIL FROM.
 2.Breaks mailing lists (all have to be whitelisted - see:
   https://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/working-groups/asrg/currest/msg00762.html
   You do have a section in the draft regarding mailing lists. But this 
   section is not correct. Correct would be to say that those usind DS 
   records MUST NOT send email to mailing list UNLESS mailing list has been
   WHITELISTED ON THE SERVER. There just no other way to deal with mailing 
   lists (not if it supports DS records or not, does not matter).
 3.Breaks majority of forwarding configurations. Again you have to 
   whitelist servers that may forward email to your server. Here the 
   situation is little worth, because spammers often put the use the same 
   domains in their from (ok, used to do it 2 years ago, now using free 
   mail services like yahoo or hotmail is more common)
 4.Roaming users (like me on IETF conference) can not send email directly 
   and have to authentication with their "home" mail server. Actually this 
   is the list of my problems... I would really prefer to separete SUBMIT 
   and server<->server SMTP and require authentication on SUBMIT.

On Sat, 22 Mar 2003, Gordon Fecyk - Home wrote:

<http://www.pan-am.ca/draft-ietf-asrg-dsprotocol-00.txt>

As I haven't yet submitted it to the IETF, the version number hasn't
changed.

The big question I was asked two weeks ago was: "What selfish reason do I
have for implementing this protocol?"  Well, I've now provided several.

I've also added notes on mail forwarding, which is still going to be
affected.  Mailing lists seem unaffected - every list I'm subscribed to
either has "[$LIST]-request@" as the envelope sender or some other envelope
sender for tracking delivery failures.

Finally I've added a note about RFC 2821 section 7.1.  That section says how
efforts like mine remove otherwise useful functionality.  I've tried to
address that.

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