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RE: Make the Internet uncensorable to intermediate nodes

2010-03-24 00:08:33
Hi Mark, 
 
You are incorrect.  I am not referring to IPSec, VPNs or Secure Shell.
I am not even referring to TOR (I don't put the solution before the problem).

I am referring to the goal:
1) Unsnoopable
2) Untraceable

The set {IPSec, VPNs, SecSH} meet only the first of these.

There is a functional difference between IETF continuing to work on 
protocols associated with 1), which there is a commercial need for today, 
and embarking upon standardizing protocols which address 1) and 2),
for which the purpose is political.

I am not opposed to this work.

Does it have to be standardized, and does it have to be IETF?

With regard to affronting hosts, I would think that anyone who visited
a home or a country would behave politely.

I am always polite and respectful of people in the USA when I visit, and
understand it is a privilege (as a non-Citizen) to be there.  

My message alluded to the fact that there are different patterns of 
politeness in many East Asian countries.   One of the issues is that
politicising IETF work would put our peers in China in an untenable 
position with regard to the authorities.  

These are the people we are going to China to engage with and encourage.

The people you may be angry with are not these people.

Please take the political activism somewhere else, where it will be more
effective. 

Sincerely,

Greg Daley



________________________________

        From: Mark Atwood [mailto:mra(_at_)pobox(_dot_)com] 
        Sent: Wednesday, 24 March 2010 2:16 PM
        To: Greg Daley
        Cc: MtFBwU; ietf(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org
        Subject: Re: Make the Internet uncensorable to intermediate nodes
        
        
        On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 11:24 PM, Greg Daley 
<gdaley(_at_)netstarlogicalis(_dot_)com> wrote:
        


                I would actually not encourage IETF to work on such a 
technology as this,
                particularly in the lead-up to IETF Beijing.  That would be a 
serious affront
                to our hosts.


        By "as this", you are referring to both technologies such as "Tor", and 
also similarly useful technologies as IPsec, VPNs, and Secure Shell, all of 
which are useful and are used today to "Make the Internet uncensorable to 
intermediate nodes".

        The Chinese government seem to be excessively affrontable, and entirely 
too many westerners are enablers of this.  It's insulting, by western 
standards.  If "the west" has to worry about insulting "China", then "China" 
can get a clue about being insulting to "the west". The Chinese government can 
grow a thicker skin.

        ..m


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