Chris,
I think you are being too definitive about the ESPC people.
In particular one of their issues is that there is no way they have at
present to tell whether a list a customer gives them is genuinely 'opt-in'
or not.
I just went to the RSA show. In return for giving my email I got approx $30
worth of free merchandise. So yes all that mail is going straight to the bit
bucket but I cannot complain that the email is completely unsolicited.
Yep, some of those folk are working both the legit and spam sides of the
same street. Their legit operation does the well known brand names, the
bucket shop operation is run on the quiet through an ISP in Bejing. But they
are not alone there, there are probably spam senders who play anti-spam
Zealot on the net. Remember good old Matty Rimm who wrote the CMU paper that
kicked of the whole cyberporn thing? He also wrote a pamphlet on how to
attract more customers to your XXXXX hard core web site.
Phill
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Lewis [mailto:clewis(_at_)nortelnetworks(_dot_)com]
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 2:27 PM
Cc: asrg(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org
Subject: Re: [Asrg] Protecting Legitimate Commercial Email
(was Re: ESPC
Proposal)
Nathaniel Borenstein wrote:
I believe passionately that many kinds of commercial use of
email are
Very Good Things. Every bill and account statement that I
get via email
saves a fraction of a tree;
Furthermore, every every bill and account statement you get by email
puts money in our pocket too - the stuff we sell _is_ the Internet
(we're one of the world's largest manufacturers of Internet
equipment).
But.
If spam pisses everyone off so much they abandon email, the
net result
is a loss of business, not a gain.
And obviously, _we_ want to use email to market, and we do.
By not doing
the things that many of the ESPC members do - sending email to people
who didn't ask for it.
It seems obvious that the ESPC is an attempt by those who
self-define as
legitimate commercial emailers to separate themselves from
spam well
enough to construct discriminating solutions.
There be the crux: "self-define". Most if not all of the
ESPC members
are currently blacklisted here. Not because we're confusing
them with
someone else (which is what the ESPC is all about preventing), but
because they really _are_ spamming.
ESPC won't do anything to reduce spam volumes. It won't even do
anything to help those marketers get their messages through -
because we
don't want what they _are_ sending already.
The main issue isn't about identity. It isn't about content. It's
about _consent_. ESPC won't do anything about enforcing
consent on the
senders, nor allow the recipients to determine whether there
was consent.
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