At 11:45 PM 11/1/2012, Russ Housley wrote:
Mike:
As Joel already said, the recall process is not dependent on the wishes of the
IAOC.
Yup. But I'd say their wishes would have a great deal of influence on whether
or not this would go forward. And I'd still like to get at least some
indication that this is their desired outcome at this point. I think, if
nothing else, this needs to be part of whatever record considered by a recall
committee. If I heard that only 1 or 2 members were indicating support for
removal, I probably would withdraw my name from the petition signature.
Further, please note that IAB, IESG, and IAOC members cannot be recall
petition signers. RFC 3777 says:
1. At any time, at least 20 members of the IETF community, who are
qualified to be voting members of a nominating committee, may
request by signed petition (email is acceptable) to the Internet
Society President the recall of any sitting IAB or IESG member.
According to RFC 3777, sitting members of the IESG and IAB are not qualified
to be voting members of NomCom. And, there is a long-standing tradition that
IAOC members will not serve on NomCom. There is also an I-D that just
finished IETF Last Call to formally exclude IAOC members from serving on
NomCom.
Fair enough, I'd forgotten that little fillip in the rules.
I think you've also just convinced me that there's a need for an Expulsion
option in 3777bis. This effort wasn't triggered by a desire of the IETF
community to remove Marshall - we had no idea there was a problem (and some
cases didn't agree that Marshall's absence was the greatest problem put forth).
This was triggered by the members of the IAOC. To me it seems logical that a
body should be able to initiate removal of its own members for whatever reasons
it deems appropriate, but with a pretty high bar to completion.
So for expulsion - I would propose that 2/3 of the remaining members concur to
initiate the process. And that we select one of two options for confirmation:
3777 recall committee or 2/3 of the confirming body to confirm the removal. I
would also proposed to prohibit more than one expulsion attempt for a member
within a 6/9/12 month period.
One possible future optimization for selecting the recall committee might be to
choose members from the remaining list from the most recent nomcom selection
using the same random selection process and same constraints on number members
from the same organization/company. Also, stick the current nomcom "PAST
chair" as the recall chair.
Mike
Russ
On Nov 1, 2012, at 10:22 PM, Michael StJohns wrote:
At 06:01 PM 11/1/2012, Bob Hinden wrote:
While the IAOC has not discussed this formally, I agree with you. The
situation did change when we were able to talk with Marshall.
I assume at this point the IAOC would like to pursue the recall option? If
not, please be very clear about it to the list as I haven't actually seen a
request from the IAOC for that process to proceed as far as I can tell.
If you'd rather just wait from him to resign, if in fact he does, then
please indicate that. I believe neither you nor Dave Crocker nor Scott
Bradner (the only IOAC members that I think have commented on this issue on
list so far) have actually specifically asked for or signed the recall on
the list.
Mike