----- Original Message -----
From: "Lou Berger" <lberger(_at_)labn(_dot_)net>
To: "Melinda Shore" <melinda(_dot_)shore(_at_)gmail(_dot_)com>
Cc: <ietf(_at_)ietf(_dot_)org>
Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2013 1:09 PM
Melinda,
I'm not so sure debating the merits of a specific measure has value or
not is really that helpful, and I probably just should have ignore
this
small point. Let's say some limited measure of diversity is valid,
what
do we learn from it? Is the conclusion that only one group is being
discriminated against and that the IETF needs to address this one
specific form of discrimination, or is it that the top of the IETF is
far from diverse? If the latter, I buy it -- the IETF has a diversity
issue.
As many others have said, there are many forms of bias and
discrimination -- all of which are harmful, and only some of which
have
the legal protection (in your favorite country) that they should.
Irrespective of any specific statistic, I think this discussion has
shown that there is consensus that working to eliminate bias and
discrimination *in all forms* from the IETF is worth paying attention
to. Do you disagree, are you saying that the IETF should only/first
try
to address only gender bias?
I personally think all IETF participants should have voice in this
discussion, no matter if they fall into an obviously discriminated
against group or not. This includes the full range of participants,
even newcomers, folks who have never authored an I-D, folks who by any
measure are significant I* contributors, and even "western white
guys".
IMO the exclusion of any voice is itself a manifestation of bias.
I am in the happy position of not having attended an IETF meeting for a
while and for many, perhaps most, of those active on the lists I track,
I have no idea what they look like. White or black, western or eastern,
I have no idea. An e-mail address of a CJK company used to suggest a
person of eastern origins, now it just means that the CJK company has
taken control of the western one. Sometimes I cannot even tell male or
female, although the name used may give me a clue. In one case, an AD
referred to a contribution as coming from a 'he' which is surely wrong,
that is a woman's name; but I do not know, cannot tell, only that the
contributions that she/he makes are valuable and I would be happy to see
them as, e.g., AD.
So perhaps, to reduce the bias, e.g. towards "western white", any system
of choosing should give preference to the views of those who do not
attend IETF meetings, for whom judgement is based solely on the
contributions the person in question is seen to make - via the mailing
lists - towards open standards and running code.
Tom Petch
(white, western)
Lou