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[spf-discuss] Re: PermError: Too many DNS lookups at Microsoft.com

2006-05-06 13:42:32
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Marc Chametzky wrote:
Scott Kitterman wrote:
With my validator, the MS SPF record is raising an error because of
too many DNS lookups.

My SPF engine also returns PermError for microsoft.com, too. By the time
I got to the last of the three includes in the main record, I had
already hit 10 DNS-lookup-counted mechanisms.

Main record: 4 (1 mx, 3 includes)
First include: 3 (2 a, 1 mx)
Second include: 4 (3 a, 1 mx)
Third include: 0

Marc is correct.

Hector Santos wrote:
Too bad I was out of the loop when this decision was made.

Thats a major difference in SPF implementations and now you see the
effect for large SPF organization/networks wishing to support SPF.

It was also a major security hole in the old SPF specification that needed 
to be fixed.

Scott Kitterman wrote:
Hector Santos wrote:
Basically what it tells the big companies:

     "You can only have 10 different domains to lookup and if you
      CAN'T structure your SPF network as such, then SPF is not for
      you because [NEW?] SPF verifiers are going to see you as a PERM
      ERROR."

Actually what it says (in my opinion) are two things:

1.  SPF processing limits are tight enough that you can use SPF without
worrying to much about denial of service attacks based on large records
(this threat got a lot of discussion on the list and was the source of
the revised approach to processing limits).

2.  If you are a big enough provider for the complexity of your record
to cause problems with the limits, you need to use more ip4: mechanisms
in your records.  If you're mail sending is complex enough to cause a
problem, you know enough to enumerate your sending sources by IP
address.

You can always use an "exists:" mechanism to cover an arbitrarily complex 
network with a single DNS lookup.  Setting up dummy A records for all your 
outgoing MXes isn't hard.

The 10 lookup limit is a MUST in RFC 4408.  Do it however you want, but
don't claim to have implemented the RFC if you do it differently :).

Well, it's the receiver's choice whether they want to subject themselves to 
DoS attacks.  No need to call them incompliant for that.  They can't blame 
SPF then, however.

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