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Re: [Mtgvenue] Background on Singapore go/no go for IETF 100

2016-05-26 11:22:43


On 26 May 2016, at 5:47 PM, <nalini(_dot_)elkins(_at_)insidethestack(_dot_)com> 
<nalini(_dot_)elkins(_at_)insidethestack(_dot_)com> wrote:

He said that he doubted that there would be any problem at all in Singapore. 
 He also suggested that I contact the Singapore Consulate General in San 
Francisco.  (Which I will do once >>they open)

I will ask them the following questions:

1.  If two gay men with a baby (or child) come in to Singapore customs 
together, will there be a problem?

2.  If two gay men with a baby (or child) walk the streets of Singapore 
together, will there be a problem?  Will they be harassed or arrested?

3. If two gay men with a baby (or child) check into a hotel in Singapore 
together, will there be a problem?  Will they be harassed or arrested?

“Oh, yes. We are totally going to harass visitors to our country,” said no 
consulate spokesperson ever.

I get your point.  I think they would say that this is not something we approve 
of, or is our custom or some such coded language.  I will also call the South 
East Asia desk of the State Department to see if they have any complaints.  
That will be a US viewpoint. 

But I think for some people, no matter what I or any of the other people say, 
they will not be convinced.  So now what?  I think we are pretty much at that 
pass today.

There is no way to achieve 100% consensus or have 100% guarantees on anything. 


4. If two gay men with a baby (or child) need to go to a hospital or a 
doctor because the baby (child) is ill, will there be a problem? Will they 
be prevented in any way from being >>with the child? Will they be harassed 
or arrested?

The question is not whether the hospital staff will have the gay men arrested. 
They won’t. It’s whether the hospital staff will consider them to be actual 
parents. There are medical >decisions only parents can make such as 
authorising surgery, or authorizing an epinephrine injection for a severe 
allergic reaction. In most jurisdictions including Singapore injecting >a 
child with epinephrine is assault unless there is either parental consent or 
it’s a life-or-death situation. If the child’s parent is not there, medical 
staff is force to wait until >>it becomes a life-or-death situation. Note that 
even though sex between women is not criminalized, this issue affects lesbian 
couples just as much. Same for the secondary issue of >allowing them to be in 
the room with the child.


Fine.  I will ask that.  I believe Harish is also talking to medical staff.

I suspect the odds of needing surgery while travelling for one week or needing 
an epinephrine injection are quite low.  If your child has severe allergies, 
then the parents generally travel prepared for such events.

But, again, I am sure that you can always offer cases which have not been 
foreseen.  What if this, what if that?  Sure.  No one can guarantee you 
absolute safety under all conditions.

Nalini


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