Re: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102
2017-04-13 13:38:38
On 4/12/2017 8:44 PM, Stephen Farrell wrote:
That's a fair point. I think though that it also puts on onus on
any folks who adamantly think we ought continue to meet in the US,
to also publicly justify that, given the opposite arguments already
voiced on the list.
Does it also put the onus on say the UK and the rest of the EU to gaze
into the future and promise that the breakup will be amicable and that
there will be no changes in the current passage rules between the two or
even between EU members?
As much as you might like to require someone to prove a negative - it's
generally understood that proposing that someone do so tends to be more
of a political debate trick than anything else.
Looking back in history, immediately after 9/11 - arguably the biggest
provocation the US has received during the Internet era - 4 out of the 5
IETF meetings immediately after 9/11 were held in the US under the
increased travel scrutiny that we take for granted now and we adapted.
The current questions are or need to be: What are the changes and can
we adapt.
We have a US President that has made big claims and broad pronouncements
- but here's the thing. He's not a dictator and he's bound by strong
laws and constitutional requirements that limit his reach. Basing a
decision on whether or not to hold meetings in the US based on only what
Trump says and does vs what he might say and do vs looking at what
actually happens (e.g. travel restrictions held in abeyance due to
perceived constitutional violations) seems to be taking counsel of fears
rather than counsel of facts.
I would suggest that we not cancel SF and use it to gain FACTS. I would
suggest that by the time SF comes around the bulk of changes (if any)
will have occurred and we will be able to quantify their impact on the
IETF participants in the scope of that meeting and whether future
meetings will need to be held elsewhere for a period of time or whether
we're able to adapt. I would further suggest that the impact of having
one "bad" meeting would be minimal in the broader scheme of things vs
not having a consensus and agreement on both the actual problem and the
solution to said problem.
Mike
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- Fwd: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102, Leslie Daigle
- Re: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102, Stephen Farrell
- Re: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102, Joel M. Halpern
- Re: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102, Stephen Farrell
- RE: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102, Eric Gray
- Re: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102, Stephen Farrell
- RE: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102, Eric Gray
- Re: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102, Joel Halpern Direct
- Re: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102,
Michael StJohns <=
- Re: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ
- Re: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102, Michael Richardson
Re: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102, Randy Bush
Re: Update on feedback on US-based meetings, and IETF 102, Yoav Nir
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