In <p06000d14baa98f13e128(_at_)[192(_dot_)168(_dot_)1(_dot_)104]> Kee Hinckley
<nazgul(_at_)somewhere(_dot_)com> writes:
At 10:14 PM -0600 3/27/03, wayne wrote:
In <p06000d07baa9567f9e7a(_at_)[192(_dot_)168(_dot_)1(_dot_)104]> Kee
Hinckley
<nazgul(_at_)somewhere(_dot_)com> writes:
We are now getting RBLs who [ ... ]
If by "now", you mean within the last year or so, then ok. [ ... ]
First I've heard of it. So for me it was "now". Your point?
My point is that people have been expressing their opinions about spam
sources via DNSBLs for a long time and many of those opinions haven't
been worth the bits they were printed on. Contrary to your
implication, this is not something new.
I think that advertising a RBL, getting people to use it, adding
innocent ISPs to it, and then charging them to get off is pretty close
to blackmail.
I don't think it is at all close to blackmail. First, Blars isn't
threatening to expose information if you don't pay him money, he *is*
exposing information. Secondly, there is nothing wrong with charging
people money when those people ask you to do some work. Third, my
take on his "fees" is that he doesn't want to hear from anyone about
how he runs his blacklist, but it is more effect to say "I will ignore
you unless you pay me big bucks" than "I don't want to hear from you."
> And yes, people actually subscribe to these.
So what? Can't people do what they want with their own machines?
Certainly. I was simply trying to point out that there are serious
problems with some of the RBLs. Your point?
I guess the thing that triggered my to respond is that we get enough
proposals to solve spam to this list as is and many of those proposals
have serious problems. We don't need to bring up every example of
spam "solutions" that are badly implemented. Shall we start
discussing all the bogus spam content filters that are out there and
somehow use them to imply that all content filters have serious
problems? What about ISPs that don't enforce the TOSs and AUPs?
Bringing up this DNSBL, implying that it is "new" and calling it
"blackmail" is very close to flame bait.
1) Don't bother sending that person (or ISP) email anymore.
Thank God the phone system doesn't work that way.
Uh, the phone system does work that way. If I call you and you tell
me you don't want to hear from me, I better stop or I will find police
at my door.
2) Try to convince the person (or ISP) you sent email to that they
shouldn't be using that DNSBL, but understand that they are under
no obligation to change.
I'm sure my father would figure that one out on his own.
Well, yeah, but the same goes for all other spam filter systems.
3) Try to convince Blars DNSBL to remove you. In this particular
case, you will have to put down a sizable deposit and if Blars
decides that you were correctly listed, you will probably end up
paying that deposit to him.
You're assuming that "I" am someone who runs their own mail server.
Please get real here.
I am "real" here. These are your choices. Well, I guess I should
have also included "4) switch ISPS". If some of the choices are too hard
for you, then you need to choose a different one.
Sending email to someone is not a right. Your ISP probably restricts
you from sending mass mailings to random people. If you don't like
this restriction, you basically have the same four choices. If the
destination email address has restrictions, whether DNSBLs or
otherwise, then again you have those four choices.
Personally, I doubt that many clueful person (or ISP) use Blars DNSBL
to block email and I would almost certainly choose option 1.
In this case, the RBL is used by another RBL. Osirusoft. Do you
suppose that people who subscribe to Osirusoft's RBL are aware that
they are aiding this kind of thing?
Ok, I was not aware that Osirusoft was using Blars DNSBL, however,
this really isn't that important to me. My testing of particular
Osirusoft DNSBLs that I actually use show very low false positive
rates. So, either Blars DNSBL isn't used by those particular
Osirusoft DNSBL, or Blars doesn't block very much valid email.
-wayne
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