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Re: call for ideas: tail-heavy IETF process

2013-05-15 10:06:57
IMO, IESG should have grounds to reject any document that isn't specifically 
authorized in a WG's charter.

- Keith

On May 15, 2013, at 10:55 AM, Ted Lemon 
<Ted(_dot_)Lemon(_at_)nominum(_dot_)com> wrote:

On May 15, 2013, at 10:41 AM, Keith Moore 
<moore(_at_)network-heretics(_dot_)com> wrote:
The motivation for a particular feature of a protocol is not clear enough. 
At the IESG review stage, protocols should not be blocked because they 
provide capabilities beyond what seems necessary to acquit their 
responsibilities.

I strongly disagree with what the NON-DISCUSS criteria say. DISCUSS isn't 
just for blocking documents.   And document quality is as important (in the 
sense that poor document quality can lead to as many interoperability or 
other problems) as technical correctness.

The interpretation of this particular NON-DISCUSS criterion that Joe has 
given is simply wrong.   The key word to pay attention to to see the error is 
"motivation."   The point of this criterion is to eliminate a very specific 
sort of stall that has been known to happen in the past: the stall where the 
AD doesn't understand why the document is being put forward at all, and 
therefore blocks the document until the authors explain the motivation behind 
the document to the satisfaction of the AD who is holding the DISCUSS.

This is a real issue that has created real problems in the past, and that is 
why it is in the NON-DISCUSS criteria.   But this criterion _does not_ mean 
that a criticism that the document itself is unclear is not a valid reason to 
hold a DISCUSS on it.   In fact, it's an excellent reason to hold a DISCUSS 
on it.   A lack of clarity in a document can result in it being implemented 
incorrectly, or in the case of a BCP, interpreted incorrectly.   Or in 
extreme cases, not read at all.   This is a bad outcome, worth spending time 
on, even if the authors would rather be quit of it.