ietf-asrg
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Re: [Asrg] RE:ASGR 8a Use of certificates

2003-04-08 14:04:07
At 11:01 AM -0600 4/8/03, Vernon Schryver wrote:
Have you never received a junk fax with a bogus banner, without
a knowable source telephone number, and advertising a web page?
I have.  How would I trace the junk faxer?

How do I trace a junk pre-recorded phone message that asks me to
record my number or push some touch tone keys to be called back?
I received many of those before July, 2002.

No to both. So we're back to an ascertainable fact that neither of have access to. What's the percentage of those compared to the percentage of equivalent obfuscations in email. Oh well.


 > Unfortunately most of my complaints have been for unsolicited
 pre-recorded calls.  Which means manually describing the things.
 (Unless you can point me at a place where I can submit an audio file!)

How do you trace them?  Most that I've received are far less traceable
than any spam, since all spam has an IP address but I often have no

The ones I've received have always given a phone number to call back to.


 3. contrary to the authentication snake oil, all spam is more identifiable
  than many pre-recorded phone calls, because pre-recordeds often lack
  all ID data but all spam contains an IP address and usually contains

I'm going to assert that most pre-recorded calls contain address information that allows you to track them down. After all, they want the user to contact them. Why would they obscure that information?

Does that argument sound familiar?

Now I'm going to take it back, and state that while I believe that, I have no evidence other than the phone spam I've received to back it up.

 4.  It makes no sense to say the contact information in spam, whether
    URL, telephone number, email address, or postal address, is
    untraceable, but the same is traceable in a junk fax.  If fact,
    junk faxes and spam have similarly traceable contact info.

It does if you assume that it is far easier to create untraceable transactions online than it is over the phone. That is what I am assuming. I know what it takes in software and hardware to generate pre-recorded calls--I've been involved in that business. I don't know what services are available within the States to make that untraceable. I seriously doubt there are too many services doing that from outside the States, because of the costs of international calls. However, I don't know. I could be wrong. Without sufficient evidence I'm not going to argue the point. Suffice to say that I'm not making a nonsensical argument.

--
Kee Hinckley
http://www.messagefire.com/          Junk-Free Email Filtering
http://commons.somewhere.com/buzz/   Writings on Technology and Society

I'm not sure which upsets me more: that people are so unwilling to accept
responsibility for their own actions, or that they are so eager to regulate
everyone else's.
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