spf-discuss
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Re: fair chance?

2004-07-15 15:28:24
In <200407151127(_dot_)21153(_dot_)jonagard(_at_)amazon(_dot_)com> Jonathan 
Gardner <jonagard(_at_)amazon(_dot_)com> writes:

On Wednesday 14 July 2004 01:48 pm, Marc Kool wrote:
Microsoft has taken a big step by showing their willingness to merge with
SPF Classic. [...] Things don't go as fast as you may like,
so please be patient and wait with more criticism until Meng has had
another talk with Microsoft.


Better yet, let's just ignore them.

I do not think it is wise to ignore what MicroSoft is doing, or in the
case of the SenderID license and the complete lack of testing of their
PRA algorithm, not doing.


                                    They aren't a major player in the email 
game. Sendmail, AOL, Yahoo! and others have a lot more say than they ever 
will. In fact, even these guys pale in comparison to the rest of the 
internet community.

I disagree.  MicroSoft is a very major player in the MUA area
(Outlook) and many of the changes we want require upgrading MUAs.
MicroSoft's Hotmail and MSN systems are major sources of email and
their MTA (Exchange) is used certainly one of the top 10 most used MTAs.


If you watch what is happening on MARID and here, what Microsoft says is 
mostly irrelevant. In fact, MARID overturned a great chunk of the Sender ID 
compromise between Meng and Microsoft.

I have been watching what is happening on MARID and I think that what
MicroSoft says is very relevant.  It has take a *lot* of work to
overturn things like XML in DNS.  Without a lot of work, other
bad/untested parts of the SenderID proposal will be accepted because
there is a strong consensus that SenderID, in general, is a good
proposal.


Part of the work that needs to be done to make sure a bad license
doesn't make it to being an RFC is to make sure there is a rough
consensus that such a license is unacceptable.  This can only be done
by posting a message to the MARID list that later on, you can point to
and say "See, I stood up and said that <whatever it is that you feel
is important>".  Do you shouldn't post a rant or bash MicroSoft.  You
don't even have to post detailed analysis of your views, in this case
a "me too</aol>" type post is enough.

The same goes for things like support for SPF-classic's MAIL FROM
checks or or HELO checks, anything else.


-wayne